The Greatest Hoax Of The 21st Century: 2012 Armageddon

Reasons behind Dec 21 2012

Why have so many lies been told in order to create fear over this date. This is an open ended question that could be answered many many different ways. I think the reason that makes the most sense is to profit from it. Many people have websites on this subject which creates ad revenue, and sells their Ebooks. This date has been blown out of proportion for pure greed. Another reason is for recruiting religious groups. Any time there is the possibility of a world changing disaster people feel more inclined to convert to a religion for two reasons. The first being that maybe there devine being they worship may spare them from the catastrophe, and the second being that they will go to heaven or a similar place apposed to hell. In my opinion these are the reasons why some are spreading fear about this date.

Hurricane Katrina

Current Weather Theory

Some people attribute our changing climate to the fact that we are coming closer to Galactic Center.They say that we are experiencing more Natural Disasters because the magnetic field is disrupting the Earth. This is false because we are not going close to Galactic center, we are actually moving away from it (see my post on the Galactic Plane). Our climate is changing for several reasons:

1. Human Emissions and pollution, this is what is causing the majority of the climate change

2. The Earths orbit

3. Relationship between the Ocean and the Atmosphere

4. Volcanic Eruptions

5. Activity of the sun

The emissions you and I create enforce the greenhouse effect. Humans are causing the climate change not the Galactic plane, Nibiru, or anyone else. I know that we like to blame others for our mistakes, but it is us that is destroying our beautiful planet.

Nostradamus

Prophecies

Some of these Dooms Day theories are derived from Nostradamus and the Bible. To both of these I give no weight to them scientifically. For Nostradamus his predictions are so vague that they are open for interpretation. I am not very familiar with the bible but again, both of these sources bear no weight in a scientific discussion.

Planets on December 21st 2012

Planetary Alignment

The above is where the planets will be on December 21st 2012. They are not even close to being aligned. One storey is that all the planets will align on December 21st 2012 and it will also be aligned with the Galactic Plane. I have already debunked that we will not be going through the Plane in the year of 2012. There will be no planetary alignment on December 21st 2012 period. It amazes me that some people are still lying to you, trying to spread fear and sell there E books that all have to do with "Surviving 2012".

Earth's Magnetic Field

This shows Earth's magnetic field during a magnetic shifting of the poles.

Pole Shifts and 2012

There are two different theories on the pole shift that will occur on December 21st 2012. The first I will talk about is a magnetic pole shift, which is a reversal between the North and South poles. The second pole shift I will be covering is a physical shift of the Earth's Crust.

Magnetic Pole shift: The above picture shows the Earth during a magnetic pole shift (which is currently happening).As you can see the Earth's magnetic field is not dormant during this pole shift, it just becomes more complicated. So as this pole shift occurs the Earth's South pole could travel up to Asia, or to Africa, until the poles have completely swapped spots. During this pole shift we are still protected against solar storms and space radiation. A Magnetic pole shift is a slow process, it takes hundreds even thousands of years. The biggest consequence of this pole shift will be changing our compasses in a few hundred years.

Physical Pole Shift:This occurs when the Earths crust shifts. We have had a few degree physical pole shift, but not a physical polar reversal. This would take a vast amount of energy that could not be linked to any increase in solar activity, or natural cycle. A physical polar reversal would be devastating to the Earth and its inhabitants, but you would not be able to pinpoint a day of this event or if it will even happen.

Galactic Plane

Galactic Plane Theory

What is the Galactic Plane? The Galactic plane is a gravitational field stretching out from the black hole in the center of the galaxy, that has a very high force of gravity. The black hole in our galaxy has an estimated mass of one trillion stars, which is what gives it such an enormously strong gravitational field. Because the black hole is so massive, it spins incredibly fast which causes the Galactic plane to be quite thin and it also causes our galaxy to have a spiral shape. In the picture above the Central Galactic Plane is the gravity field created by the black hole.

I am not denying the fact the this plain does exist, because it does. If we were passing through it in a few years it would lead to catastrophic disasters on our planet. Because the Earth moves in a sinusoidal curve back and forth over this Galactic plane we are heading towards it, but will not move through it for a long time.

So what would occur if we did move through this Galactic Plane? Large solar flares, like nothing we have seen before which could scorch the Earth. A pole shift, and many natural disasters. These natural disasters would be unlike current natural disasters they would be much larger and more intense.

Now I will try to show you why this will not occur any time soon. Right now we are not very close to Galactic center. And precession is such a slow process the position of Earth with respect to the galactic plane on Dec 21st 2009 will be very similar to the position of earth on Dec 21st 2012. It would make more sense in fifty to a hundred years time. Not the short period of time until December 21st 2012. However, from other sources this cycle occurs approximately ever 33 million years, and there is evidence we crossed it three million years ago which would indicate we would still be moving away from Galactic center and not towards it.

Summary

The galactic plane is a real thing, caused by the black hole in the middle of our galaxy. Passing through it could be catastrophic, but we will not be passing through it for another 30 million years. There is evidence showing the Earth passed through this plane three million years ago.

The Mayan's

First off a brief history of the Mayan's. They were a ancient civilization that were brilliant astronomers. There calenders were accurate enough to track every planet in its orbit and then show dates of astrological events such as a lunar eclipse. So where do the Mayans come into play in this hoax you might ask? Well they have a few calendars, one of them called the long count calendar. It has a period of 5,126 years, the end of this long count calender is set for December 21st 2012 (the long count calender on this day will be 13.0.0.0.0). The Mayan's never predicted the destruction of the Earth on this day, instead they said great change would happen on this day. They never said what the great change was, it could be the destruction of the Earth, however, others speculate it to be a shift from our old ways, a kind of a spiritual evolution (I on the other hand believe no such spiritual evolution will occur). Also the calendar might be just reset from 13.0.0.0.0 to 0.0.0.0.1. Some say that on this day the Earth will align itself with the galactic plane, this is false though, it will not align with galactic center. No where does it say the doomsday will occur on December 21st 2012. We tend to think beginning to end, which is completely different then how the Mayan's think, they thought in cycles, their calendar does not end it is just another cycle.

Do not live in fear because nothing will happen on this day, it will just be another day except the doomsayers will feel really foolish. However, it is always important to have a plan for natural disasters as these could occur at any time. It is important to have enough water and food to last you a month, as well as survival clothes. I urge you right now to make a survival kit for you and your family and always be prepared. Right now there is a lot more to worry about then 2012.

A Wong Translation

A Sumerian Stone Tablet

The Sumerian's part in the hoax

First off who were the Sumerians? They were an ancient civilization that existed from 2900-1800 BC, who lived in the area of mesopotamia. A large amount of evidence supporting 2012 is taken from the Sumerian's.

I will start by talking about the above picture. In the above picture it has been said that this shows every planet in our solar system, in the correct dimensions and distance away from the sun (Jupiter the largest, Earth the third planet etc etc.), but it also shows 12 planets. If you minus the sun and the moon (they thought these were both planets) that leaves us with 10 planets. This is where the myth of Nibiru comes from. Nibiru is a planet said to be four times the size of Earth and having a 3600 year orbit around the Sun, its orbit comes very close to Earth. The picture above was originally translated by Zecharia Sitchin. However, the symbol for sun in the Sumerian culture is not what is in the middle of this diagram, it closely resembles the symbol for the sun (below is a picture of the Sumerian symbol for the sun, now look back at the picture above and compare the symbols), but instead it is the symbol for a star. This is counter argument number one to Planet X (Nibiru).

The second argument being if it truley was only about four years away from close contact with the Earth we would be able to see it by now. In some reports it has four times the mass of earth. If it was coming at Earth it could not be more than a billion killometers away, therefore we would already be able to see it. For example Pluto would be both further away and smaller then the approaching Planet X. It is believed by some that on this Planet X is a race called the Anunnaki (meaning those from Heaven in Sumerian). They are an alien race that came to Earth on Planet X's last orbit into the inner solar system. There is talk of them being the creators of the human race, and giving the Sumerian's knowledge of the planets in the solar system. Which some use to explain the picture above because the Sumerians would be unable to see Pluto without a telescope, but I have already explained that the picture is not what is appears to be. And if these superior beings did give the Sumerians Knowledge of our solar system why would they tell them that both the moon and the sun are planets when they are not?

I believe the most concluding evidence is the lack of evidence of this Planet X. It is fantasy, nothing more.

Nibiru hoax Quotes

A picture of the Sumerian Symbol for the Sun

Good Brief Overview of 2012

Bad Astronomy

Phil Plait\'s Bad Astronomy: Misconceptions: The Planet X Arguments in a Nutshell
Phil Plait's Bad Astronomy. This is an indepth look at the coming of Planet Nibiru, and how it is in fact, not coming. It is a strong argument based on scientific fact. P.S. Nibiru was scheduled to arrive in 2003.

Planetary Alignment

2012 galactic alignment: hoax
A Nasa Astrobiologist explains that the Planetary Alignment is an internet hoax and nothing more. He goes on to say that this alignment is impossible.

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S.C. Vital Speed 3 years ago

I must say thi is a cool hub, but I respectfully disagree. Everything you said does indeed make it all sound like a hoax, but there is countless evidence that ranges from the Bible to modern astrononmy which all suggest that 2012 will be a year of unparalleled traumatic change. Nostradamus predicted that 2012 might be a year of apocalyptic proportions. There have been apocalyptic predictions throughout history, but this is the first time that they are actually coinciding with the real world. Nibiru may indeed be a hoax, but the planet is physically decaying and the sun is nearing it 24th cycle in which it will peak and there are a string of countless scientific theories about what could happen, none of which is pleasant. The Galactic alignment, is going to occur on 2012, and that only happens every 26,000 years. There are many scientists that believe superwaves from the center of the galaxy might at the very least wipe out all electronic communication or complete obliteration at most. .... must i go on?

Lastly, Nibiru is more than likely true but hidden from the public by the government. Planet X has been known for decades that it existed because of the effects its huge gravity has on the other planets in the solar system, and it was also known that we weren't able to see it due to its highly eliptical orbit which take 26,000 years to orbit the sun. The reason we aren't able to see it yet is because the first time it will be able to be seen in the northern hemisphere is in the second half of this year. Right now planet X is visible in the southern hemisphere will a telescope and naked eye in antarctica. I guess we'll find out for sure if its a hoax or not sometime around June. :)

By the way, I am too in my second year of college and majoring computer science. I look forward to your next hub.

Matts88 Hub Author 3 years ago

Great point, there is a lot of evidence pointing towards this event, there is a lot of hype, which is getting people very very scared. However, most of it can be explained, most of it has been blown out of proportion. So here is my reaction to your argument: On the bible you got me, I am not very religious and do not have very much knowledge of this. But in the world of Science the Bible does not really hold up to well... As for Nostradamus I also give no validity to this source, his predictions are vague and he has predicted dooms day before. The galactic alignment and galactic plane I will be getting to this eventually, I have found software on the Internet which allows you to see the planets orbit on everyday of the year, even into the future. I will post a picture of my findings, you may disagree now but please keep an open mind. The people writing their findings want you to be scared, it creates hype. Check back often, I will be updating this hub soon, thanks for the comment Vital Speed you made some valid points.

Lissa 2 years ago

@Vital Speed you are misinformed there really is no such thing as galactic alignment the planets are never completly aligned.What occurs every 26,000 years is called precession and it will occur on 12/21/12 as it always has every 26,000 years all it basically means is completing a rotation and we will eventually pass through the galactic plane which some scientists fear will leave us open to more meteorites,asteroids,etc...But,their current calculations range anywhere from a few hundred to a few million years.As far as the bible goes I really don't know how it ties in the last time i heard the thumpers were saying 5/11.

Lissa 2 years ago

I would also be interested in knowing what scientist has said superwaves from the center of the galaxy could knock out eletronic communication.During solar peak which happens every 11 years a large enough flare could disable eletrical grids and communication I dont remember when but part of canadas electric grids were knocked out by a large solar flare once.Currently the sun is devoid of sunspots.Nostradamus his predictions were so vague you can really interpret them to mean what ever you want usual after the fact.I also don't know of any current modern astronomer that currently believes this rubbish astrologers sure,but,there is a huge difference between the two.

I'am a true lover of astronomy and always up to date on what is occuring in our universe as a matter of fact the only reason i'am up now is so that I can see comet lulin during its once and only approach to earth 38million miles is pretty darn close.

Matts88 Hub Author 2 years ago

I have never heard of this solar peak which can knock out electrical grids. I will have to look into this. I am also an very interested in astronomy. Comet lulin was that the one that is flying tail first? I wanted to see that comet but it was overcast last night where I live. Thanks for the comments :)

Joe Gioielli 2 years ago

Oh well, I guess I better start making my credit card payments again.

Stupid Myans.

Matts88 Hub Author 2 years ago

Haha yup that would be a good idea Joe :).

Lissa 2 years ago

The solar flare occured on march 6th 1989 it tripped one or more power grids in quebec.Its not the solar maximum or minimum that does the damage its a large sunspot emitting a cme or solar flare. We usually reach maximum during the suns polar reversal last week a sunspot emerged that was still part of solar cycle 23 and a couple of days ago they found one part of cycle 24 but its already fading.Each solar cycle roughly last 11 years.If a large enough flare hit it could disable communications from our sattilites,etc...it would not actually physically kill anyone on earth.

Lissa 2 years ago

Yeah, Comet Lulin is actually moving the opposite direction of the planets.

Angela 2 years ago

My husband, sis in law, and I have been talking about 2012 for a while now. I go through cycles of saying, "ha! what hog wash!" and "oh hell, we're doomed!" As a rule I don't buy into doomsday prophesies, but 2012 stuff is everywhere. Thanks for boosting my rationality. Fear mongering is pervasive these days. I read a book in college about Mayans and modern folks who carry on their traditions called "Breath on the Mirror"--non-fiction. There is a great deal in it about naming the days...as some people still do this. It's always occurred to me that the calendar would eventually reset. I don't figure the world will end when my desk calendar runs out of pages or that my bank account is empty because I run out of checks.

Tim 2 years ago

Thanks for putting my mind at ease!

Saristotle 2 years ago

:) good to hear

Zero 2 years ago

I'm going to run down my steet naked on 12/21/12. Why? Because it'd be funny, just like it'd be funny if I did it tomorrow.

Hell yes.

John 2 years ago

If we are alive after this date. 01/01/2013 there is a huge party at my house!warm beer no electricity but beer none the less!

Kevin 2 years ago

One little point. People keep throwing in the Bible:

1. as if it had anything to do with this 2012 stuff, but then giving no support to that claim. The Bible is not a book of hidden codes, secret messages, or doomsday predictions, and no thoughtful respecter of the Bible reads any of this 2012 hype into it.

2. and then dismissing it with, "I don't really know anything about that." If you don't really know anything about it, then you have zero basis for either accepting or rejecting any bearing it may have on the subject.

japzlloyd 2 years ago

same here.. i don't really know anything about that!

doker 2 years ago

SC Vital Speed, just wanted to inform you that you're retarded. He basically debunked every single point you "made". Oh, and the massive planet X is more than likely to exist, and the govt knows about it due to its large gravitational influence on other planets? Well mr. retard, you might want to learn about this other planet, called Jupiter. It's over thousands of times the size of the earth. Oh yeah, there's also this other planet, "Saturn", which is also orders of magnitude larger than earth. So Planet X, if it existed, which it absolutely does not, would have a negligible gravitational effect on any planet, unless of course it passed RIGHT BY us... in which case the site creator noted, we'd be able to see it by now.

Thanks for showing us how stupid you are! It was good for a laugh or two.

John 2 years ago

I think something will happen in 2012 in it's not just another Y2K scare. There are so many things that our great ansestors have warned us about. We should really take this 2012 date as a warning. Crop circles are already showing up the size of 4 football fields mapping 3D images of our solar systems accross england. 2012 is here and we should act now. Bee's are dieing, people are starving, and the aliens are coming. LOL!

Gman 2 years ago

You never know...everything here and around is theory anyway.

Nice to see some thinking outside of the box tho

Gupster 2 years ago

'Accept nothing without proof, Dismiss nothing without proof'

Open your mind to everything

DevRN 2 years ago

Doker: I think you really should respect others thought. Do you know about your own body?it's part!it's active cell!how nerves are connected on each part of the body.

It's all pre-design. Vital didn't say he discovered he was going thru some of the theory. You take science or Mythology both are based upon theory.

I don't know whether 2012 is true. If not then okay. But if it is then we should at least try something to save. Again it's different matter whether we can do it. But what's harm in trying.

Since last 1 year I am also seeking the great evidence and I have gone through so many books. But still I am unable to find the exact reason. Eventhough I'll not say it's hoax. I'll say I am not expert on astronomy so may be it is being difficult for me to believe all.

But fren I've one observation: people who are programmer, hacker or those who are in technology basically. They are believing it. I don't know why. I am also from technology Background. And somewhat I also believe this.

Daniel 2 years ago

I think that this whole thing is (excuse the langage) all shit!

Not a retard 2 years ago

Ok, if its true then we all mostly die. So what?? The planet is doomed with so many people anyways. I just hope I live. IF not, so be it. Rest of you can shove off. HA!!

420John 2 years ago

all i know is that the galatic alignment will happen there will be an eclipse causing 2 days of darkness. the magnetic poles are changing and there will be solar flares heading toward earth. who knows what will happen. just know on 12/20/12 and 11.59pm i will be enjoying myself a fat joint waiting to see how everything plays out.

GoToChurch79 2 years ago

Has anyone seen the hilarious commercial and website on the Institute for Human Continuity (IHC)? or watched the interesting videos on YouTube(2012 fact or fiction 1-8)? These scientists are doing a great job promoting their doomsday books. No man nows when that day will come.

420John 2 years ago

Ya with the lottery for survival and stuff. i went to the website and its a legit site. but on the commercial it says on the bottom this film has not been rated.....rofl

Nate 2 years ago

the fact of the matter is NO ONE KNOWS SHIT, so dont get all freaked out about 2012 just be prepared, just in case cause ill tell you what the government is getting prepared... maby you should take precautions as well.

Matts88 Hub Author 2 years ago

No one really does know, I believe I have disproven the most common of the doomsday theories. You should always be prepared for natural disasters.

jiberish 2 years ago

You covered a lot of ground, I'm hoping that things will take a smooth transition like from BC to AD. Great Hub!

I_will_still_be_here 2 years ago

All this blather is just to sell books. Nothing odd will happen on 12/21/2012 except all you ding-a-lings who believe this will be embarrassed, and probably DISAPPOINTED! Imagine that. "Rats, we're wrong and are all still alive."

Russell 2 years ago

I don't believe 2012 will happen, considering that it looks very ridiculous imagining a hell lot of natural disasters happening at once.

But if it does happen, it happens. But I think it would be because some of us, to be honest, are treating earth horribly.

Percy 2 years ago

I looked a lot of these sites on both ends of the spectrum and this is the only one that would back it up with evidence. How is it that several scientists (professionals in their respective fields) when asked what the significant event is going to be, no one knows. The closest response we have received is a polar shift and we don't know by how much, how long it will take and what effect it will have on our planet. But they can claim that they have enough evidence to come up with an exact date. Just check out a couple Youtube sites and see what I'm talking about.

Also, Earth has gone through many changes over hundreds of millions of years. It's never been a sudden change that takes place over days or even hours. Why would it suddenly start now?

lbtrader 2 years ago

I agree with you on the hype aspect of 2012. We could blame the ease of publishing on the Internet for that. But on the same token we could say that the host of hubpages is nothing more than a parasite living off of the avails of the herd.

If you make a penny off of this hub does that make you a charlatan and a hoax.

I personally publish plenty of blog posts on 2012 issues and yes I make 2 bucks a day from the hundreds of hours that it took me to research the material. Does that make me a snake oil salesman.

One thing I never do is make claims about any of the 2012 scenarios. Society as it is today could use a good dose of higher consciousness and some 2012'ers state that the great year will be nothing more than a portal to a better world.

You are right there crooks who would say anything to make money from the subject. But did it ever occur to you that wherever there is talk of money or the exchange of money there is likely to be a thief in the near vicinity.

If earning money from talking smack on the net was a crime then likely half the blogs and websites would be shut down.

Maybe they should be?

Our world might be a better place then. But it would be an infringement on free speech.

2012 might be a total hoax as you claim but I will personally only say that when 2013 shows itself.

jcurrie 2 years ago

The Grand Planetary Alignment - Not 2007 or 30013 BUT 1982-1984. Back then the planets aligned, people predicted that it was the end of the earth, nothing happened but it looked great. Nice site to look up and see all the planets clearly. Not a straight line but a slight arc.

Meeeeeeeeeeeeee 2 years ago

You makea great point with this. I don't think the world will end on this day, but I must say I will be scared to death when it gets closer to 2012..LOLZ.

pussykat 2 years ago

I live with a bloke who eats, breathes, and dreams about this stuff and is making my life completely miserable saying we have to move to a 'safer place', learn combat, store enough food for 3 years, learn to make candles and bla bla bla! I got so depressed few months ago I did not even want to be here at all! Now, thankfully, I am at the point that I choose to live my life in the present, with love and joy, and bugger this stupid comet!! Let it come, I say, but its not going to destroy the life I choose to live now..in each moment!!

mike 2 years ago

um september 15, 2014 is the actual date when things here will go major apetard. NOT 2012. We have an extra 2 years almost.

funkymonk 2 years ago

Well this is very interesting, I am into the 2012 whole idea, but I do not believe that anything bad would happen, you all talked about the bible , but did anyone think of the "Quran" which is the Islam religion book, I am not a religious person but based on Quran some facts deny that the end of the world would be 2012, I am not saying Quran is right, I will just state few of what has been mentioned there, and also by profit Mohammad and other profits:

Signs of the End of the world based on the Quran:

1. World War 3.

2. Palestine would be free from Israeli's and claimed back by Palestinians.

3. Return of Jesus Christ.

I honestly do not recall anymore, but many others things have been said, and again i say, I am not saying Quran is right or wrong, I am not against Israeli's, Palestinians or whoever the land belongs to in the first place, I am just saying in a way that, if 2012 is doomsday then Islam and Quran is wrong, one must be right, either 2012 or Quran.

I am just trying here to ease it off some people who are afraid of the 2012 world end, if you want to know more, take religion books in consideration, Christian, Muslim and Jewish, take what they say, compare it to science, compare it to media, get the best out of it, there must be conflicts and lies in the end.

Sorry I do not mean to offend anyone here, just trying to help :) peace to all!

funkymonk 2 years ago

alright, found this article here that is around the same subject of what I've mentioned above

http://hubpages.com/hub/COULD-2012-BE-THE-BEGINING

Matts88 Hub Author 2 years ago

mike says:

25 hours ago

um september 15, 2014 is the actual date when things here will go major apetard. NOT 2012. We have an extra 2 years almost.

And so it continues, new doomsday theories, every civlization of man thinks his time will be the last, every civlization of man thinks the era they live in is the most important (of course) none of us want to think that one day our current civilization will be considred ancient history and regarded as quite primitive.

tyler 2 years ago

the scariest part of this 2012 hype is the ignorance of the collective human mind. even if nothing happens in 2012 the events leading up to that one date will have dramatic impact on a global level. this doomsday theory is unique because it is being brought to life years before it will actually arrive. this time allows for more widespread panic

perpetuated by the ignorance of man. 3rd world countries would not have been affected by y2k even if it had been a disaster. 2012 will spread into the minds of every person on the planet. whether they believe or not doesn't matter. what matters is that collectivly all human consciousness will be focused on this event. the prospect of what happens when 9 billion plus people are focused on one event is more terrifying to me than any of the 2012 theories

N89 2 years ago

well I'm a bit worried...I try to be all brave saying that people r just trying to panick us...and reading people disproving this event has calmed me bt I kno tht I will be terrified come tht day

tpott 2 years ago

Quick question who do you believe when everyone contradicts themselves?

Q: What is the polar shift theory? Is it true that the earth’s crust does a 180-degree rotation around the core in a matter of days if not hours?

A: A reversal in the rotation of Earth is impossible. There are slow movements of the continents (for example Antarctica was near the equator hundreds of millions of years ago), but that is irrelevant to claims of reversal of the rotational poles. However, many of the disaster websites pull a bait-and-shift to fool people. They claim a relationship between the rotation and the magnetic polarity of Earth, which does change irregularly, with a magnetic reversal taking place every 400,000 years on average. As far as we know, such a magnetic reversal doesn’t cause any harm to life on Earth. A magnetic reversal is very unlikely to happen in the next few millennia, anyway.

Are we in a magnetic shift or not? are the physical poles shifting or not? hypothetically the energy needed to cause this major shift that everyone says there is no evidence of is present everywhere solar flares will increase 2012 -2014, sucks during a magnetic shift! But who needs to worry about solar energy messing with magnetism, gravity, or our weather when you have the brillian scientists at NASA to do it for you. I don't know lets show all these skeptics how much faith we have in science by proving we can do anything and not cause 2012 to come about. Perhaps we should fire a rocket at the moon, mess with its gravitational relationship with the earth, tides, and weather so we can find water for our space geeks to drink. Lets spend billions to prove we can inhabit a rock that isn't going to save anyone when shit does hit the fan. Did any of these geniuses think, hum, I wonder if we do find water, and even if there is a .000000099% chance it is linked with the symbiotic relationship between the moon and earth, should we risk our planet, even if the risk is .000000099% especially during this HOAX 2012 period? Nah, its Nasa THEY'RE USED TO WALKING ON WORLDS, I'm sure no species destroys itself.

Once the scientist, specialist and elite in there field, learn how to prove a theory hoax by offering scientific data and proof sufficient in even the least respect to discount all these possibilities. I think let the theorists have their theories and let the scientists earn their wages.

Divyanshu 2 years ago

Might be , a quite significant change would occur bcoz how far earth and/or our civilization(as a whole) would go in a monotonous way

If anyone knows these lines : "Day out n day in, same news with a permanent repeat . . . dis world is Rotting"

It's from Death Note (A wonderful anime series with Excellent beginning n English dubbing too . .. )

Devon Buy 2 years ago

doker, your language sure doesn't help. Everyone is entitled to an opinion, and if yours differs, kindly express it respectfully. No one likes having a bigot around, especially a rude one. This topic is something that has not been carved in stone or proven scientifically, everything is still in speculation - you could be right, but you could also be wrong. And if the latter, the words you used - "retard" and "stupid" would just fall flat in your face.

Imagine a few hundred years ago prior to the discovery of Uranus with a telescope in 1781, when you stumbled upon the Sumerian Tablets that tell of all the planets, and you considered these tablets and the Sumerians retarded and stupid, talking about planets that don't exist, just because your powerful telescope couldn't spot it, something as "big" as Ur-anus...(haha! sorry, pun intended! don't mean to be rude myself)

Enjoy HubPages! ;-)

joebob 2 years ago

just because some old civilizations thought the world might end doesnt mean it will. there is no real proof that i found that will make the world end on 2012. if someone could please show me PROOF i might be convinced. and werent we supposed to die in 1982, 1988, 1991, 1994, 1996, 1997, 1998, 1999, and 2000? whats so special about 2012 when there were HUNDREDS of wrong predictions?

oh and the bible says nothing about 2012 being the end of the world, just says NOBODY KNOWS WHEN IT WILL END. :)

Messenger 2 years ago

I agree all of this 2012 stuff is realy a bunch of hype and a shamless plug to sell books and movie tickets. If 2012 was the end of the world; what could you do about it? Run outside throw your hands up and try to keep the sky from falling? I am also a Christian and everyone keeps saying that the Bible also claims 2012 is the end of the world.

All I have to say to them is to read it again; it says that no man knows the day or the hour. The only good thing about all of this is to remind people that life is a gift and it is short; so make everyday count. Okay that is the end of my rant.

Alex W 2 years ago

Here's a fun thought:

What if, in our panic for 2012, we ended up destroying humanity ourselves before December 21, 2012 even happened?

The irony. Honestly, I'm more scared of the months leading up to the date than the actual date.

Gov 2 years ago

FIRSTLY ALL THE ABOVE FACTS ONLY SERVE TO SOLIDIFY THE FACT THAT 2012 WILL BE DOOMS YEAR!

Media has shocking control over many peoples mixed opinions of what is actually happening or what is going to happen...

and some people are still holding on to this planet because they are simply "enjoying there lives".

But what I can say is this...there are tons of info pointing out that 2012 will be a doom year.

And most or I can go as far as so none of the people that gave out these facts are even vaguely interested in MONEY!

We're talking about the whole planet dying "being destroyed" here. Why would they care about money. A human manufactured control mechanism.

The Mayan civilizations calender points out 2012 is the end of their calender.

Nostradamus Predicted it.

The Bible clearly states it.

Jesus spoke of it.

Buddha spoke of it.

NASA has put out the facts that the Ice Caps have melted more than 70% GONE!

And without the Ice caps there is nothing reflecting the Suns heat back into space.

NASA has also picked up planet X (Nibiru) heading straight for our region in space which will effect gravity as we know it.

NASA - Earth is moving towards the galactic centre which is filled with space debris.

and the 7 years of suffering the bible speaks of NASA has also identified that earth will be traveling through the galactic centre for 7 years.(Between 2008 - 2015) And 2012 is the year it will be the most in the centre.

People do not want to change there ways and there is a thing called karma which most people still do not understand.

Astralogicaly it is the end of the Piscean age.. and the beginning of the Aquarian age...

There are tons of facts which I have failed to mention due to being upset at some peoples miss information and confusion.

When I said karma... I meant the way people live...Everybody still eats meat and meat has to come from killing animals...

And meat eating is the No1 cause of Global Warming.

For those who still don't know.

So at the end of the day people have to wake up..

Find an enlightened LIVING master e.g. Master Ching Hai.

To gain a better understanding of your true self...

Not your physical..but your spiritual self ...for earth

is just a place for us to experience God ...as we all have

God within...and all living beings have god within and to kill animals is like killing your own brother...as animals are just the position you as a human being are put into when you haven't lived your life right previously.

So because of a lack of Love and Understanding the world has gone into complete chaos and people still don't realize what is actually happening.

And with all the debates ...Leaders are just waisting time and doing nothing in the meantime to change the world to make it a better place..

Many people believe in there religion and have found no real living master...E.g.

Jesus is a master but was only transmitting (the light, heaven) when he was alive. Now that he is dead the world slanders is name and created christianity or the way of christ. But there are not many vegetarian christians at all which Jesus was.

Buddha was also the same and they created a religion after him.

Muhammad the same and they created a religion after him.

They predicted the end as well ...but only as a warning for people to change.

Not as a Prediction of DOOM and GLOOM!

And not for people to follow bad doctrines.

The only advice I can give is to follow your intuition and don't let the system control your thoughts and thinking...Free your minds and open it up to the greater good and possibilities. Do not let media dictate to you what is happening.

Go to "Mythology" section in your library or book store and read books. Not the Bullshit media feeds you. Don't listen to puppet world leaders like Obama etc.

I'm also a surfer and I can tell right now that the oceans water is way hotter than it was 3 years ago...and this is significant as it is not reverseable... We are at a point of no return & the only thing I will & can Promote here is Vegetarianism ...I make not profit from this ...we all make profit as One Energy.

I can only say: Love and Peace to all you wonderful beings out there lets hope we can change.

tyler 2 years ago

hey gov u are full of crap

anybody who looks around can see that we are on the brink

of a massive clensing of life on this planet.

your little surfer chants do little in the face of the horrible wonders that await our gluttonous society.

2012 is crap thats what this hub is about

a stupid made up event to insight fear and increase consumption. consumption will be our downfall that is why the ocean is warming. Soon the earth will fight back as it is also a living organism capible of fighting diseases like the human race.

tyler 2 years ago

a couple more things gov

1. Nasa's official stand is that all the astrological events predicted for 2012 are made up. No rogue planet, no eclipsing the milky way, no major sun storm. The sun does go through cycles, but nothing catastrophic.

2.The number 1 cause for consumption of fossil fuels is the production of concrete and cement, not eating animals. Why dont u just tell people to stop growing hair. Eating meat is not escapable. You cant escape natures design. You can adapt to it and reach a plain of spiritual enlightenment that holds the secrets of the universe. But as a poker player I must say that it is not in the cards for everyone.

Wubbahduckie 2 years ago

Christ was a vegan??? Not hardly. Christ was a Jew, and as a Jew, kept the laws of Passover. The laws concerning Passover ( given by Jesus ) was to follow the old laws of Passover, in fact, he was so adamant about this that every detail of Passover had to be kept. I'm not sure where you got your information from, probably the same person that claimed that Jesus was a Capricorn ( also false lol), but facts remain within the human physionomy. We were created with teeth of omnivores. GOD himself made us in his image, and guess what? Yeah, we have the same tooth pattern type as other omnivorous animals: bears, raccoons, monkeys, etc. No animal has this type of teeth except those designed to eat a wide variety of foods. Canine incisors to eat flesh weren't a mistake...or are you wise enough not to say that God was faulty in his design, and that Jesus broke his own laws and was a hippocrite?

tyler 2 years ago

to gov

I think we agree on some key points

So lets begin fellowship. Spiritual enlightenment goes beyond earthly notions of heaven and hell. Spirits of man and animals and all living things lyes in infiniti. Which means that I have typed these words an infinite amount of times. The ice caps have melted an infinite amount of times. The earth has been created and destroyed an infinite amount of times. After a given amount of time every thing repeats. Since time is infinte and cyclical the very atoms in my body will assemble and disperse an infinite number of times.

Our biggest debate gov is that you think people should change. Stop eating meat, untite for common good,etc. I'm not saying you are wrong for thinking that. My research has been done by observing my environment. The conclusion that I have come to is that nature is not force to be changed. Believe me as a father this hurts to type, It is mans collective destiny to consume. Consume until our demise. Please try to change this Gov. But do not forget that the finish on your surfboard was brought through consumption. The sex wax you use for traction is consumption. Everyone consumes even in the face of future disasters that we can only speculate about.

Last Legend 2 years ago

what's more annoying is how people still dicuss this false prophecy. the world should of eneded eons ago with all this prophet stuff. lets see, i predict,oh the year 2666, the world is done for sure!

tyler 2 years ago

To Gov

I'm still curious. do you beleive 2012 is the year of doomsday, or do you think it is a hoax. Is this hype or is it real? No random tangents. Yes or No.I would like to know.

Also I would like to say that I have grown gardens and I have killed animals field dressed them and processed their flesh for future consumption. Both growing and killing were deeply moving spiritual experiences. Have you had either of these experiences. If so share. I read your article. Not bad. Alot like thousands of other nameless propaganda special interest articles on the web. Not to discredit this or any other article, I'm just very skeptical about everything I read online. I did like wubbaduckies reply. I'm curious as to what didn't make the page. Peace

Newlogics 2 years ago

Wow.... Gov, you should really cut down on acid and pot...I know this whole "surfer dude" image mandates thst, but damn boy, you can't type a single coherent sentence. I'm just happy I'm a good two hours away from Santa Cruz (as far as I know, it's the only place that can produce such specimen as you, so I assume that's where you're from)

of course 2012 scare is a hoax. Our society craves sensations, so when there is a lack of real ones, we produce them. nothing new here. I do, however, hope that enough idiots join some sort of cult that calls for a group suicide on that day. Our planet ia a bit overcrowded.

Newlogics 2 years ago

on a side note, I think I'll take advice of mr Maddox and sponsor a vegetarian. I's easy: simply pick a crazy vegan, and for every animal he doesn't eat, you eat three. Exotic ones are especially good.

Everyone should try it.

Sam MAiden 2 years ago

I am not sure what is going to happen but we will see.

magnoliazz Level 4 Commenter 2 years ago

Follow the money! Just like Y2K, the year 2012 will come and go without so much as a whimper. All the hype is about MONEY! Don't buy into it.

There are plenty of other things that you should be worrying about, like the economy. We have more than enough problems without creating more yet.

sagewriter 2 years ago

The educators of the world have failed mankind if the poor reasoning ability of their students would fall for this. Maybe 2012 will be a rallying call for universal science education since the panic that ignorance causes in that year will be stunning. "The only thing we have to fear is fear itself..."

But then again- tourism will be up a thousand fold in the next three years since we will all spend our savings

(which are worthless come 12/21/2012) to travel and see this beautiful planet one last time... 2013 will be another baby boom since , hell why use birth control on 12/20 ! So sell your condom stock, invest in the travel industry, and liquor stock since there is going to be a whole lot of binging going on.

By the way, did any seasoned investigative journalist look into the investment portfolios of the biggest 2012 zealots?

If they still have one they obviously don't believe their own hype.

Aidan James 2 years ago

Its just another Y2K all over again.

Lots of apparently educated folk 'taking precautions' but not a jot of real science anywhere... meanwhile the astronomers are laughing at the whole idea.

I won't be stocking up on beans and water unless a real scientist tells me I need to...

and they won't be doing that.

btw - as the Mayans could not predict their own civilisation ending, what make anyone think they could predict the end of the world?

Truthseeker 2 years ago

I have been following all the hype concerning 2012 for many years now, it started with a VHS tape put out by Time Life regarding the Mayan Calander and it peaked my curiosity to date.

Here is my take. People are spreading fear for personal gain, there is no argument there. If people are in a state of fear they are more vulnerable, pliable and easy to lead. I am though concerned about solar flares the chaos that would ensue due to no electricity, internet, phone ect. would definitely push people to the edge. Look at what's starting to happen in Haiti, people are freaking out and these are people that have lived for generations with little to nothing. If something of that magnitude or higher was to happen here in the US or another large populated country the chaos woutld be worse than the situation. As the original poster said. Be prepared for any kind of disaster, one could happen anytime. Also if you're reading this blog, then you too have the resources to check out for yourself what is or is not going to happen. Stop being "sheeple" and believing blindly what others are saying. Do your own research.

Umesh 2 years ago

There have always been earthquakes, tsunamis, volcanos..etc, thats just how the earth operates; not to deny that there is a spiritual significance to both good and bad. Intelligent civilazations have thrived for over 2500 years...per the english literature; but according to hindu literature humans are atleast 1300*1000 years old. Is it not easy to think end will NOT happen in a day? Its got to be a slow process...world will not go in to an ice age in an hour, earth will not boil in a day...it will come but not precisely on 2012.

Gov 2 years ago

I will post again what I tried to post a few weeks ago and it did not make it to this page...Unfortunately. I have to rewrite tons of research and truth. Which takes quite a long time...should have kept a word doc. on what I wrote.

But lets hope the Author of this site lets me Post it up again. For now I'll say this "For lack of Knowledge my people will Perish".

To Newlogics:

Its unfortunate that Media has made u believe that surfers smoke pot and take acid. Surfing has never been an IMAGE but a Legitimate Sporting field my friend. Try it some time you might have some fun.

To Tyler: Every Experience is a spiritual Experience - Since we are Spirits in Bodies not bodies. Making every single act a spiritual act! correct me if I'm wrong.

This is exactly what the world needs. People to defend the "Status Quo" and -Ostracize- those who do try to make a difference. Continue, and everyone that is against me on this site will eat there words in a few years time ...its unfortunate..even then I will not be able to say...I told you so..coz it will be too late!

Remember Jesus' last act was an act of Animal Liberation - Hence He was Murdered. Its unfortunate that so many people can be Blinded to the truth. Watch this space for my post AGAIN.

But that post might be taken off as well ...Just like my last two.

Oh well that is how evil works I guess ... Bias works for some...

tyler 2 years ago

to gov once again

you are full of crap

you have again lost all credit with me

Jello 2 years ago

Once it was fun to worry

About who was in control

Could look into the future

But now it don't seem right

Passion is filling the air

Profits are better than life

And things are harder to bear

Oh, well, things crumble to an end

Hell, we all die in the end

Die in the end

Jazz 2 years ago

As a computer scientist who has dabbled with a lot of physics in my time, it is impossible to tell when something of such an unreliable and macroscopic nature can be predicted to a single point.

To this extent I believe that the world will not end; I also believe that religious texts hold a mass of moral standards that should be adhered to. However I don't believe that what is written in them will happen or has happened.

All creative works of writing are set up in a way to make them more interesting to read; otherwise a book would be a list of facts and much less desirable.

Finally.

To Gov: eating meat is part of who we are and if everything living had a spirit then we should not be allowed to eat at all. Also anything made was at some point living. From my keyboard to my shirt, from my plastic water bottle to a metallic water tanker and from every piece of gravel to every single building, they all came from something living originally.

In fact the vegetables you eat probably grew from some dead creatures’ carcass rotting in the ground not just manure and hard work.

It's weird to think that alot of the rocks and minerals we see and use are actually compressed dead animals.

Mozzer 2 years ago

A death for no reason

And death for no reason is MURDER

And the flesh you so fancifully fry

Is not succulent, tasty or kind

It's death for no reason

And death for no reason is MURDER

And the calf that you carve with a smile

Is MURDER

And the turkey you festively slice

Is MURDER

Do you know how animals die ?

Kitchen aromas aren't very homely

It's not "comforting", cheery or kind

It's sizzling blood and the unholy stench

Of MURDER

It's not "natural", "normal" or kind

The flesh you so fancifully fry

The meat in your mouth

As you savour the flavour

Of MURDER

NO, NO, NO, IT'S MURDER

Oh ... and who hears when animals cry?

uLtraSix 2 years ago

yes this is looking like it is going to be an interesting read... before i go any further please run your article through a spell check you need a question mark in your first statement and you misspelled divine as devine... I think that's a name... Divine Being.... Please correct so at least some people may have the fair chance of placing value to what your saying.... Thanks man

uLtraSix 2 years ago

1. Human Emissions and pollution, this is what is causing the majority of the climate change...

I do not agree when you say Humans... if you were to say major corporations and large number of like-minded arrogant humans are causing climate change I will agree but I am a human and we(our group) does not contribute to carbon emissions or pollution to where it would effect global statistics... You need to do more research than you already have Mr Know it all... Reword it accurately or take it down, else you are a terrorist unit!

uLtraSix 2 years ago

dude u suck you misspelled too many words to keep my attention you obviously do not know anything about this if you cant even spell simple words like story... "storey" and you published this on the web? What the hell are you a disInfo agent of lies? You think you are so smart I challenge your knowledge any day sir... Please forward me to your sources for my own investigation.

Gov 2 years ago

Part 1: My comment just strangely seems to be blocked from this site!

To Tyler:

No probs...I'm sorry for your anger.

I don't yearn for credit. I'm only attempting to open peoples eyes... to the truth about the world for the greater good...shoot me!

Your reaction is one of the traits of eating meat.

I don't believe I ever called you "full of crap" or any kind of derogatory word.

Why don't you spend some time to open up your wisdom eye

search on the net for "why people must be vegetarian"

Peace my friend lets hope eyes open one day...

I unfortunately do not have the pleasure of being able to ARGUE with people, its simply a waist of time.

But I will always do my utmost to present them with plain and simple clear facts.

There is a difference between a Belief and a Fact...correct me if I'm wrong.

Secondly, I'm yet to be corrected where I'm wrong...Not told that I'm full of Crap...Maybe "Crap" means "Knowledge" in you language...

Then I would say I am FULL OF CRAP.

Thanks ...love you too

Also to answer your question whether I believe 2012 to be doomsday or not. My answer is: It's up to humankind to change for the better and respect the living planet and its animals, life, environment etc. or to continue to trash the planet, and then it might very well happen...

Meat eating is responsible for 80% of Global Warming!

And never in the history of this planets existence has there EVER been such a thing like Global Warming.

David 2 years ago

the human race as been evolving for 100's of 1000'S OF YEARS AND LOW AND BEHOLD THATS COUNTLESS 26'000 YEARS we survived, this is just a money maker for doom mongers and film makers

Donavan W. 2 years ago

Great ideas all...although

It seems that the longer (and longer and longer) the discussion or blog (on any thought/event on the net) continues, only proves that everyone involved do not have all the, or enough facts so to cause/create a simple ending to any discussion as would a book written by a researcher having tediously collected facts. Thus only creating uncertainty, confusion and even panic and you we all know what that leads to. Many mechanisms for this so-called doomsday are being proposed providing our wonderful media with more and more variations for creating ingenious crap/entertainment. We are fueling the hogwash that's being put out in the world back into our own minds.

So be it. Talk about things. Discuss and share facts, but until we have all of it and the reign of speculation is over..I'll put my money on not spending all my money before 2012.

OMG 23 months ago

The cause for the 2012 Doomsday fabrication is the same thing that caused the degeneration of this site into near incoherent ramblings about whether eating meat is acceptable for humans or not.

Humans, for some inexplicable reason, seem have an innate need to prove themselves masters of nature. We mistakenly trade formula for mother’s milk, resist our biological convergence to eat meat and deny that we are just part of nature’s intended path. Sadly, this seems to be all in hopes we ascend to some mystical level of enlightenment and power.

I really enjoyed this site and the work that went into it, until it decayed into trivial debate. It just goes to show that entropy still rules. But remember it does so regardless of contrived dates, false prophets or people who think they are smarter than what brought us here in the first place.

Thank you to the people who posted and actually did the research…and to those who just expressed their unsupported beliefs as truth, please go forth and find others just like you and confine your time enlightening them.

drbrahms 22 months ago

The 2012 phenomenon is fun and educational, and therefore not a bad thing as long as the participant has his/her feet on solid ground. There are loonies in every faith and discipline but they don't discredit the thing they think they represent. Look at the Fundamentalists, for example. Since looking into all of these theories, I've learned quite a bit about history, geography, ancient cultures, astronomy and psychology. So I think the debunkers, too, overdo it in their scathing criticisms. Truly I don't think the world will end on 12/21/12 or that some magical transformation will take place! But I marvel at much of what Terrence McKenna had to say - he was more poet than scientist and as such opens new insights even as he makes you laugh. There are others we can learn from, and "2012" is simply a giddy point of departure from our work-filled materialistic lives. Don't let the crazies with their farfetched prophecies or the scientists with their insistence on measurable evidence spoil the fun.

And besides, who REALLY KNOWS? NOBODY!!!!!!!

Kayla 22 months ago

If a polar shift is supposed to happen every 25,000 or 400,000 years, and if it's supposedly so devastating to life on the planet, why is there still life on the planet today? If a polar shift is supposed to mess up everything, I don't see what could be so harmful about it considering that the last major extinction was 65 million years ago and not 400,000 or even 25,000 years ago.

rc8148 21 months ago

This has been a great hub with many intellegent arguments. Fact is for the past 5 years I've been out here in the world trying to make a difference with reforestation, sustainable energy, etc. anything I can do to be part of the solution, not the problem of this planets' demise. Finally I'm back in civilization (more or less) and researching possible events on 2012, Mainly Planet X theories because they seem the most reasonable. I actually believed 2012 to be hope for the planet, not doomsday, and I'm actually a little disappointed that it's all just a hoax. So....Thanks to all for the info. I would like to leave you with this thought;

Accepting the evolution of life as a truth, it is safe to say that life wants to keep on living. With every new generation of every species a message is passed along genetically in the DNA for improvements and adaptations to the surrounding environment. This has been happening for millions of years, and countless "doomsdays" until now. Evolution has created us, beings well aware of our surroundings with the curious nature to learn, research, and be aware that there really is a threat out there that could end life as we know it, weather it be an asteroid, Planet X or the galaxy center. What amazes me is the fact that we have the intelligence to actually do something about it, an advantage no known living creature has ever had, and we're turning a blind eye. Amazing. I hate to say it but in my opinion evolution f***ed up this time around. Almost everything we do is against nature, against the laws of evolution. I personally welcome any 2012 events, but until then I'm continuing with what I can to save this planet.

lad 20 months ago

Mayans never say and never thing end world id 2012 its only end cycle calandar and start new cycle

Alex Alcyone 20 months ago

Great article. What's not commonly discussed is that decoding the Mayan calendars is extremely difficult. The conquistadores destroyed most of their writings. From what's left, scholars disagreed vigorously about when the end date of the current cycle should be. One scholar states that it was actually in 1546!! That's how wide the discrepancies are. Here's his work. Take a look, it's interesting. http://users.skynet.be/fa039055/softwkat.htm

Steven 20 months ago

The world will not end

Steven age: 11 20 months ago

The world will not end scientests just made up 2012 just to make money and only God knows when the world will end and most scientests don't belive in God or think he is not real. I do not belive in 2012 at all. I am not offending scienctests I am just saying nobody knows when the world will end. Just pray and hope for the best. I will stay up until 12:00 a.m. on December 21 2012 and nothing will happen so just treat every day as if it were your last. And in 2012 the movie there is no possible way there can be a wave 28,ooo feet tall or a 10.9 earthquake or California falling into the ocean. So I am 100 percent sure nothing bad will happen on December 21 2012. If you agree with me please write to me here. So just be happy with your life and don't worry nothing will happen in 2012 or for a very long time. God will give us a warning if the world is coming to an end. so be good and don't belive in 2012

Dan 20 months ago

I hate to burst your bubble but unless you have been alive for thousands of years and you are looking at the solar system yourself and tracking it, how do you not know that these sources where you are getting your info is not lying to you or just wrong. Anybody with common sense in their head would realize nothing on this planet always goes the way it is supposed to. How do you know that once we get so close to the galactic plane that it will not pull us in at a faster rate then we are moving now. Just dont think you are right with your hoax theory because you dont know just as well as noone else does. That is why it is a theory!

rob edwards 19 months ago

there is some good info on video google type in project camelot interveiws valery uvarov and download save in documents then just watch very intresting please watch and let me know what you think my email address is at the bottom of the page but is possible watch all of project camelot interviews i promise you that you will be amazed project camelot interveiw scientists and ex goverment officals all over the globe.

heather82uk@hotmail.co.uk

robert edwards 19 months ago

oh i forgot project camelot is about planet x and other very intresting things aswel all good